This is tape number three, and I'm interviewing Clary Rosenblom.
How was he dressed?
He was dressed like a soldier. German soldier clothes, both of them.
And there were German soldiers waving in Auschwitz.
And then we came, and we saw barbed wire there, and what did we have?
I only saw dead bodies.
There was no barracks where the train had stopped.
Nothing.
Only barbed wire that we saw far away.
And all of a sudden, it went really fast.
So we stood up, and all of a sudden, we saw, you see,
that here and there and there, we saw how they did it with their hands.
But we were like...
I mean, I reacted anyway.
I mean, we thought we were going to be together.
And then we saw them whispering at you, who had been working on the trains.
So they started whispering.
"Mum, hold the child's hand. Hold it. You should see that you are older than you are."
"Whisper one to me."
I was so thin, you know.
A very thin boy.
"And you should see that you are older than you are." And my mum wasn't old either.
But she had a knot in her throat.
"You should see that you are older than you are."
And that was wrong, right?
That's why she died.
But she wasn't going to survive anyway.
Because she had...
She had something to do with the lungs.
But you know, in the ghetto, she was healthy all the time.
She wasn't sick.
It was a kind of virtue that she was healthy.
She didn't cough or anything in the ghetto.
What happened when you came to the German military?
We came to the German military.
And it wasn't because we had anything else to think about.
My grandmother was next to me, my mother and my sister, and suddenly they were sharing me with my mother.
And in front of us was another family.
They didn't have any children, only one daughter.
My mother said to me, "Clary, stay next to Blanca."
"Stay next to them."
And that was the last thing my mother said to me.
And I follow her, and I see her in front of me.
And my sister, you know, she was so cute and beautiful.
And I've forgotten to tell you how happy and how much I loved my mother and father.
My mother, you know, how proud.
She was very beautiful.
But I don't remember her like that.
I remember her when she got sick.
My mother and father have always told me how beautiful she was.
They told me after the war, and all the time at home as well, as I remember.
They went dancing.
And my father always brought chocolates.
And on Shabbat, they went to my grandmother, so he always brought sweets.
To my grandmother and to my mother, and to our home.
But he was so proud of her, and he said,
"The whole world is mine when I go out with her on the street."
And when they got married, they told me, those who survived,
that he, or my father, also told me how proud my father was of me when I was born.
What happened to you when you left your mother?
Yes, when I left my mother, and I actually stayed with them all the time.
With this Blanca, this Aunt Blanca, and her daughter, who was older than me.
Did you get asked anything?
Yes, they just told me, "Go in and take a shower."
And that we should take off everything, just keep our shoes and watches.
We were allowed to leave everything behind.
And then they started to cut our hair.
And there was no mirror, so we couldn't look.
There was no mirror.
So they didn't know how we looked.
So we got these dirty clothes on us, and I had to keep my own shoes.
Those who had good shoes, so.
They also had a savings from the Germans, their own shoes.
And everything down, with all the private things.
I remember that I came in a navy blue dress with white trousers,
and it looked like a sailor's dress.
And then we thought that my mother...
It just went away that we would meet again.
That's what we thought. Just another place.
So when we were done, and they had long hair, black long hair,
where did you cut all your hair?
And then they even went with the machine.
Who cut your hair?
All the Germans, mostly. Only Germans.
I thought they were Germans.
But maybe they weren't.
They were Jews who were hairdressers, who were employed, you know.
But men to men, and women to women.
So I hadn't seen a man in the same dressing room.
Did they say anything when you were cut?
No, they didn't say anything. Not that I remember.
So afterwards, you see, we were cut down,
and put on this, and everyone got a number on the clothes.
And then we went to the barracks.
What number was that?
A-number.
I don't remember the number.
I had no idea that I was supposed to keep it, you see.
Maybe I should have done it later,
but there was so much misery afterwards, in Helsinki.
So we went to the barracks, and there was a block there,
but it wasn't a German.
Czech.
And Jewish.
As you know, the Germans had taken them, the Jews,
so they blocked out those who wanted to work.
They were older.
So we went into the barracks, and I saw these signs.
But everything went very fast.
We couldn't...
But at the same time, we didn't know what had happened.
Thirteen people came up on a bridge,
and they just filled a broken blanket,
and the other clothes, and nothing else.
They came with the black bread, so little,
and bitter tea.
We got this...
What's it called?
That the military drinks.
And I said, "I don't want to eat the bread,
"and I don't want to drink the tea on the first days."
"No, I don't want to."
But it was bitter.
It was disgusting.
And the bread, too.
So we went out and stood by the bridge.
And when we got in,
I said, "God, so many boys."
I thought all of them were boys.
Their heads were down, you know.
But they all looked the same.
So we couldn't look at each other the way we looked.
No other way.
There was no mirror anywhere.
But then there was an appeal.
If it rained, if it thundered, it didn't matter.
So we stood out for several hours every day.
And you know, the Germans were going to torture us
just by standing there for several hours,
and you weren't allowed to move.
If you were allowed to move your head, you were.
That's when it started.
They beat us.
Who beat you?
The Germans.
And then, you know, you came back in,
and you asked...
you saw the big cross.
So you asked, "What is that big cross? It's smoking."
And then one of the boys said, "Oh, what is it?"
"It's your mother and those who are burning there."
And you looked at them and said, "They're not really smart."
Because I didn't believe that.
I didn't believe it, and neither did the others.
So when the appeals were over,
my father-in-law and his daughter
lived in the other barracks next to me.
If I was in A, she was in B.
So when the appeals were over,
you could walk five minutes after the appeals
and talk quietly.
And she worked at the train station.
She worked there?
That's where the trains came in.
And they cleaned it.
The dead, the bread and everything that was in the wagons.
And the Germans had all the valuables.
They took care of it.
And when she came every time, I asked her,
"Haven't you seen my mother with Irene?"
"Haven't you met them?"
And she just hugged me every day.
She gave me some old bread.
And thanks to her, I wasn't hungry at the time.
And she hugged me on my cheek.
She hugged me on my cheek and hugged me and didn't say anything.
Every time I asked her about my mother,
she just hugged me and didn't say anything.
And suddenly, after I wasn't...
We worked, you know.
We went to the field and worked.
And we dug paths, I don't remember.
But we had shotguns and spades, all of them.
And you had to sing, you know, because the Germans told you
that you had to do it.
And if they couldn't hit it away,
they hit the one who had the gun, who always got more.
Did you see when they hit?
Yes, of course. I got hit too.
I always thought that I had a headache.
That I got hit with a rubber band.
Because if you just blinked on the side or something,
if it didn't fit them how you looked,
they hit you.
Who hit you?
All the German blockbusters.
And the Germans.
Those who counted and those who fit us.
They stood by us when we worked or when we went.
All the Germans stood by us and followed us.
We always had a rubber battalion.
And they had rifles.
What do you call a rifle in Swedish?
Rifle.
Rifle, so the Germans also called it.
Yes, but...
How long did you have to work?
How long?
Then we got soup, which nobody had.
But we were hungry, so we ate mostly cabbage.
I remember that so well.
In the beginning, it was the thicker soup.
Then it decreased, it became more watery.
They had less food, right?
And then suddenly one day...
It was very important for us that we stayed together.
From the same town.
People.
Friends.
We stayed together, maybe we were...
In that group, there were about 50 people.
That's why I was young.
The others took them on the side.
And the gas chamber, right?
So we went to those who were employees.
So...
The others also from the same town, they ended up in another barrack.
Because they came in another transport.
Not the same as me.
But we stayed very close together, maybe we were 50 people.
And we were always together in that barrack.
Wherever we went, we were together.
So they would say that we should go and get our tattoos.
If we were in a queue, we were also together.
So suddenly we were in a queue.
And maybe I already had about 20 people in front of me.
And suddenly a German and someone came and said,
"Yes, we need people."
I guess.
"We need people from somewhere else, from Auschwitz."
It didn't take more than 10 minutes, and we were already there.
We didn't have anything to carry with us.
So we all left my town.
And we stayed together.
That's why I didn't get a number.
There were so many people, you know.
I didn't want to get a lot of tattoos.
So I don't know if I should call it luck or bad luck.
That I got away from Auschwitz quickly.
That I wasn't there for so long.
Did you have any painful memories from Auschwitz?
Did you witness anything?
No, only that they beat up a lot of people.
And then the painful memory that I knew I didn't have a mother.
But I never wanted to believe it.
Because, you know, first of all,
we had to have the same powder in our food from the first day.
And we had no idea.
Because women, you know.
That painful memory I also have.
That in the barracks babies were born.
They were pregnant.
And those pregnant women, you know,
they didn't send them to the gas chamber.
They let the baby be born.
And then they took the baby from them.
Or at the excrement they killed the baby.
And I remember, you know, that they screamed at the mothers.
They were hysterical.
And that also stays with me, a very, very painful memory.
Did you see when they came and took the baby?
Yes, I saw it twice.
Who did it?
SS women.
If there was an SS with them.
They did it.
What happened to your mother then?
Then I left Auschwitz.
Then she wasn't with me, as far as I remember.
But her next step was also like Gelsenkirchen.
We arrived from Auschwitz to Gelsenkirchen.
Also barracks, but it was not from Tegel or Tyg.
What is it called now?
It was barracks, but it was from...
Tyg?
No, it's not called barracks.
It's called, shut up, a tent.
Big military tents.
And there we slept.
How were you transported?
By train.
How long did it take?
I don't remember.
How long, but it was bombed back and forth.
The tents were well equipped, better than in Auschwitz.
It was very good compared to Auschwitz.
The food was better, the soups were thicker.
And we had to work at...
It was a central.
And there we had to work and built...
Repaired scenes and such.
And there I also have a memory of being born.
A mother who was born baby on the train.
And I remember that very well.
That she became very naughty.
I remember that.
Then we were there not so long.
So thanks to the fact that we had held together.
We also asked, who wants to go to Essen?
To another factory.
Then we discussed with all our friends.
Should we go, should we not go?
What should we do?
Then we decided with all our friends that we would go.
So we went to Essen.
From Gelsenkirchen.
They said, then you will work in a factory.
You always heard something positive about it.
That we decided to go.
But it was also a fate.
I also believe a lot in fate.
What happens, happens.
So nothing helped.
It was the intention that we should go from there.
Because after two days...
All tents and the whole train station were bombed.
People died.
For most who stayed.
How were you transported to Essen?
Also by train.
So we came to Essen.
It was in Germany.
It was a big town.
There was an ammunition factory.
There we also had very nice barracks, as I remember.
But it was from wood.
There we also got good food.
Then we went by train to the factories.
Every day from morning to evening.
How were you guarded there?
Everything, all the time the Germans.
Then there were trusted superiors in the factory.
Some were devilish and others were not devilish.
I had a German who hired me.
A girl hired me to work in an ammunition factory.
I have been a blacksmith.
I have been a blacksmith, can you imagine?
In that factory.
There were different jobs.
A German who had taught me or stood next to me.
He felt very sorry for me.
He brought me a comb.
The hair began to grow on me.
He brought me a comb.
I did not have a comb.
He always gave me something.
Was he German?
Yes, he was a German worker.
He hired me as their foreman.
He was a devil.
But you know, you were not allowed to work there.
If you were allowed to stay a second, he would scream.
The other German.
I was so sad.
I thought of my mother.
I thought of you.
My other friends, who were older, had no sisters.
My mother said, "Hold on to the bank and to the daughter."
Then I was happy.
I said, "How nice that my mother is not with me."
That I do not have to see her get beaten.
Because she got to see and share the little food.
They were hungry.
What did you do when you sat down in the evening?
You were so hungry that you always cooked food.
You know.
You have cooked in pretend.
That we have cooked food.
Therefore I knew how to cook food.
At home I did not know anything, so I did not cook food.
But she told me.
Now Clary and mom asked you, "What do you want to eat, Clary?"
"Would you eat now?"
She heard in the ghetto that mom asked me,
"Clary, what are you going to eat for dinner?"
"This, this, this, this."
I told her that I had been dismissed.
Then she said, "That aunt in Auschwitz is in the camp for a long time."
She only survived to Bergen-Belsen.
And there she died.
When we got to this place, I cried.
I could not bear it.
You know, to take such large pieces of iron and blow them.
When I prayed to God.
And I do not understand.
I prayed to God, "Please God, can you not make the factory be bombed down?"
I thought that when it was bombed down, I would not have to work.
And you know, after five minutes of flying, we went to the bunker.
And it was on the ground.
The factory was not there.
But it did not help.
Because then we had to rob instead.
With shotguns and rob everything.
Every day.
Then the railway car was also bombed down.
And then we had to walk.
Very far.
And then my shoes started to wear out.
And winter began to come.
And then we got, we did not have any clothes.
So one time, old clothes that were taken off in Auschwitz.
They have sent to different camps.
And it was all the clothes that people had worn.
So a transport came with old clothes, of course, to our camp.
And I have seen my dress on one who worked in the camp.
But the only thing I had, my shoes, still.
So it's somewhat long.
But then when winter began to come.
Then it broke and then you tied newspapers, what you could get around the feet.
Then you also got a little old hat, a scarf or you know, with the transporters.
How was it distributed?
Distributed, they saw how you looked.
What size they threw.
Then they threw one hat, one scarf.
So you had to be satisfied with what you got.
And then it happened again, that the train was down and we had to walk several kilometers.
Of course, the shoes did not hold.
And then winter came and then it started to be bombed.
The barracks we lived in.
Then it was with the fire bombs, you know.
And then we had to move, because there were no barracks left.
Then we had to move some cellars in the same place.
Cellars that they have put in beds and bridges and stuff.
But it dropped water.
We had no water to wash ourselves.
And then you started to get light, you know.
And then I was also so sad, the same thing happened.
Sad and crying.
And then you got less and less bread.
So I wondered about those who had siblings.
They were four siblings from the same town, so I know the names.
Two of them survived, they live in Australia.
Then they shared my bread every time, you know.
When they were four siblings, they got four pieces of bread.
So every time they shared one piece of bread, four small pieces.
And they knew where I was smiling.
"You have a smile more", they said to each other.
"Mine is bigger and yours is smaller."
"On smiles, you know."
"Now you get to eat up the smiles, next time the other sister."
When they shared.
I had a friend, my best friend, who died next to me in Bergen-Belsen.
Her name is Margit.
And we tried to be like siblings.
The two of us.
We shared what we had.
With each other.
Or I went out to the yard and we had to dig in the dirt.
Or we had to cook in the kitchen.
In the barracks we got some cabbage, or half a root.
Or we got an onion, which was half a root.
So we always shared.
We were very kind to each other.
She and I.
And we lay next to each other.
We have always stayed together.
Now I'm going to interrupt because we're going to change the tape.
I'm going to interrupt because we're going to change the tape.